BONUS: Hallie Rubenhold and Julia Laite on We Have Ways...
https://chtbl.com/track/39E17/podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/pdst.fm/e/pdrl.fm/9fa6a7/traffic.omny.fm/d/clips/e73c998e-6e60-432f-8610-ae210140c5b1/abdcbe1c-35f0-49ff-8a2a-ae39003761a2/091ce705-c948-4ce8-82b2-af6900fd744e/audio.mp3?utm_source=Podcast&in_playlist=8aa81b52-dc76-4e7c-80d6-ae39003761ab
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