With Jason Swett: when data structures, big-O notation and algorithms were completely useless...
https://anchor.fm/s/11c2aba8/podcast/play/18223485/https%3A%2F%2Fd3ctxlq1ktw2nl.cloudfront.net%2Fstaging%2F2020-7-18%2F9ff65c8d-a730-bb3a-7494-0662267e6fae.mp3
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